The results for the FRC straw poll are in, and it's a squeaker: Mitt Romney wins with 28.6 percent, Mike Huckabee trails with 28.1 percent (a difference of 30 votes). Ron Paul scored 15.5 percent. But those numbers include the online votes that anyone could cast by logging onto the FRC site and paying a buck. Among voters who showed up for the speeches, Huckabee won 51 percent--a 41 point landslide over Romney.
That's a fairly meaningless straw poll result, though. Here's what I learned from FRC insiders...
- Every candidate was invited, including Democratic candidates, but there was some hope that Rudy would turn down the invitation. "He showed up. That was a savvy decision."
- It was debated pretty hotly yesterday, but the consensus has firmed up. Fred Thompson bombed. "He looks like a president when he's walking on the stage, and then he starts talking and he doesn't look so much like a president."
- John McCain had a chance and sort of blew it. "Rudy's not an option. Fred's not impressing so far. Huckabee doesn't have the resources. Romney hasn't really convinced people to trust him. So people were ready to, you know, dust off McCain, clean him up, if he came here with a great speech. He didn't do that."
When I left the conference the straw poll results were about an hour away, and those results would come into play when Dobson bloc meets on Sunday. If Huckabee did well, the bloc might come out and support him; if no one broke out, the bloc might tell its members to make their own decisions. (Sort of like SEIU.) A "hell with 'em all" third party decision seems unlikely.
FRC V: Landslide Mitt
Comments to "FRC V: Landslide Mitt":
Bingo | October 20, 2007, 5:21pm | #
I think it's pretty safe to say that Fred Thompson is screwed. Why was he supposed to be the GOP's dark horse candidate that was going to come out on top?Seer | October 20, 2007, 5:42pm | #
Because that's who the media wanted to be the dark horse. He got interest for months by teasing Republicans with his "Am I running?" bit, but now that he's in he looks like garbage.AlexD | October 20, 2007, 5:56pm | #
Huckabee can win it all.He just crushed the competition in the Values Voter presentation.
Those who value the family should stand behind the right man for the job of President, Mike Huckabee.
Don't fall for the "he can't beat Hillary" statement. It's not true. Hillary is in the process of self-destructing and the conservative base has ALWAYS determined the winner of presidential elections.
Support Huckabee!
Huckabee will be the Vice President under Romney as a sop to the religious right.
tarran | October 20, 2007, 6:08pm | #
What's comical is that Huckabee is repudiating jesus, and these "Christians" are eating it up.When Satan offered to make Jesus the ruler of the world, with Jesus' word as law, Jesus told Satan to take a hike.
When Jesus came upon a group of people getting ready to execute a criminal condemned of a capital crime, Jesus convinced them to refuse to carry out the punishment.
Meantime, you have Hukabee offering to make Jesus teachings "law", in contravention of Jesus'' teachings. Hukabee is also calling for a continuation of war, and the inevitable killing of innocents, people who are not even guilty of acapital offense.
These morons who call Hukabee's positions 'Christian' ones are, frankly, collosally ignorant of what their religion actually is about. They are about as Christian as a headhunter from Borneo
Joe | October 20, 2007, 6:16pm | #
What's with the "landslide Mitt" headline? Is that supposed to be accurate journalism?More like "Landslide Mike."
Dave Weigel | October 20, 2007, 6:21pm | #
What's with the "landslide Mitt" headline? Is that supposed to be accurate journalism?It's tongue in cheek, a reference to the "Landslide Lyndon" nickname LBJ got after he stole a Senate election by a handful of votes.
Brett Harris | October 20, 2007, 6:29pm | #
Romney only received 99 votes from the Washington Briefing itself. He didn't win the support of value voters -- he just got his existing supporters to vote online for a $1 donation to FRC. Huckabee was only 30 votes behind Romney overall, but trounced him 51% to 10% among the people who actually heard both of them speak. Huckabee owned the straw poll. Romney bought the straw poll. The headline could read, "Romney Win$ FRC Straw Poll"...John-David | October 20, 2007, 6:34pm | #
NRO makes this mention about Fred Thompson at FRC I found... interesting:He gets significant warmth from the crowd when he declares, “We know that our basic rights come from God, and not any form of government.” His “we have shed more blood” line gets significant applause.I don't know if you already mentioned it, David, but it's funny the stuff that Geraghty latches onto.
Christopher Thurow | October 20, 2007, 6:40pm | #
Where did the Huckabee supporters come from? Hey you guys...this is the REASON website! Huckabee is a conformist liberal. I mean...c'mon! Go fill up Duncan Hunters site (he does have a site...right?) with your liberal garbage.Fluffy | October 20, 2007, 6:45pm | #
Top reasons why Huckabee can't get my vote:1. I don't think the Earth is 6000 years old.
2. I don't think a nationwide smoking ban is a good idea.
3. I don't want to be put on the Huckabee diet.
4. Oh yeah - I don't want our soldiers to die for Huckabee's concept of national pride.
Romney did well. Regardless of whether the blc believes him, Romney has socially conservative values. whether or not they believe it no, a Romney administration would make these people proud.
Don't Hate | October 20, 2007, 7:03pm | #
Get used to saying this people....President Willard Mitt Romney.Brian Courts | October 20, 2007, 7:05pm | #
Huckabee can win it all.Sure he can, if by "it" you mean his Tuesday night bowling league.
He just crushed the competition in the [We Want the Government to Impose Our] Values [On Everyone Else] Voter presentation.
I'll bet he did - but how'd he do in the swimsuit competition?
Don't fall for the "he can't beat Hillary" statement.
Alex, I realize by your campaign spam that you're not a regular H&R reader, but trust me that anyone around here who doesn't support Huckabee (which is to say, everyone) has not arrived at that position out of a fear that he can't be Hillary. If you're going to shill for the Huckster, perhaps you ought to at least attempt to understand your target audience and tailor your presentation accordingly. Don't they teach that in Communications 101?
Brian Courts | October 20, 2007, 7:16pm | #
Fred Thompson bombed. "He looks like a president when he's walking on the stage, and then he starts talking and he doesn't look so much like a president."Reminds me of Tyler Cowen's recent take on Thompson:
Friday I heard Fred Thompson talk for three minutes, he was so terrible I had to leave the room....
J sub D | October 20, 2007, 7:21pm | #
In order to environmentally protect cyber-space and simultaneously make life simpler for campaign tools, (they need simplicity in their lives), I present the J sub D tool post system (JSDTPS)™.X is a good person.
X supports family values just like you do.
X supports our troops.
X supports education.
X has never been caught in bed with a live boy or a dead woman.
X deserves your vote.
VOTE FOR X!!!.
Tools, effective immediately you need only the following -
IAW the JSDTPS™ X equals [insert your candidates name here].
Thank you helping conserve our finite byte supply.
David E. Gallaher | October 20, 2007, 7:28pm | #
How much better off would the whole world be if "family values" voters were as numerous as libertarians, and libertarians were as numerous as "family values" voters?If that were the case, then the libertarians could MARGINALIZE their perverted asses.
(Existence is not fair. The best stuff is always only in the margins.)
Jeffrey Northrup | October 20, 2007, 7:33pm | #
Mr. Huckabee uses his clergy credentials to manipulate the Christian voters while advocating very non-Christian values and principles in his assertion that he would ignore the US Constitution if he thought it was the right thing to do.Ron Paul is the only candidate from any party who does not check his Christian values at the door as an elected representative of the people. Ron Paul's adherence to the rule of law, rather than the rule of men makes him the most principled candidate and his Christian faith guides his every decision.
Mike Huckabee is an shallow illusion of a Christian who isn't willing to put his own ego aside in deference to his faith. It is so sad to see the FRC attendees being sucked in by Huckabee's tele-evangelist pandering.
Ron Paul is the epitome of a Christian conservative leader. All others pale against his untarnished record. No wonder they are all so afraid of going toe-to-toe with him.
J sub D | October 20, 2007, 7:36pm | #
How much better off would the whole world be if "family values" voters were as numerous as libertarians, and libertarians were as numerous as "family values" voters?The kick in the ass is that libertarians ARE family values folks. Don't have children that you can't support seems like a very moral family value to me.
David E. Gallaher | October 20, 2007, 7:42pm | #
"Don't have children that you can't support seems like a very moral family value to me."It seems racist to me.
Besides, what about Hillary's $5000 per child?
Who's supporting what?
A man's job is to sow his seed.
A woman's job is to get child support any which way she can.
gaijin | October 20, 2007, 9:00pm | #
"Don't have children that you can't support seems like a very moral family value to me."It seems racist to me.
nothing in the original statement mentioned race. What does that seem to say about you?
David E. Gallaher | October 20, 2007, 9:11pm | #
gaijin,That I have a magic decoder ring?
gaijin | October 20, 2007, 9:16pm | #
gaijin,That I have a magic decoder ring?
indeed! words are magic.
Jeffrey Northrup | October 20, 2007, 9:25pm | #
Racists read race in everything they read...and very little else ever gets through their filters.It keeps them from having to know enough to rationally debate any topics at all.
Guy Montag | October 20, 2007, 9:37pm | #
DWMissed you at the WMF/WB "protest", did you cover it? Yea, I will have pix up "soon", but still do not have the last pix up from the anti-war thingie last month.
On this one, some things that rang "odd" were snotty white kids whining about old white people lending money to non-white people. I suspect the paying it back part was the sticking point, but that was not very clear either.
Funniest sign: "Debt oppresses women"
Seems they are wishing for a return to the dowry (SP?) system? Maybe Kerry or the other ladies on the staff will know better.
All I know is, they don't seem to be doing MY cause of the USA withdrawing/stopping backing of WMF loans. It was a collection of 200 clowns, some with big silly head costumes and a goofy band, with a good loud sound system (I did not have to bring a radio to listen to college radio music).
Still confused on why they had to stop and protest a tailor shop a block or 2 away from the Washington Post.
David E. Gallaher | October 20, 2007, 9:38pm | #
My magic 8-ball confirms what my magic decoder ring is telling me:The Reasonoids, or, at least the sub-sub-segment commenting here on family values (gag me with a spoon), are racists.
Guy Montag | October 20, 2007, 9:42pm | #
David E. Gallaher,"Don't have children that you can't support seems like a very moral family value to me."
It seems racist to me.
Were you in downtown DC today? Every speaker/chanter/babbler found something racist about everything they spoke about! Even lending money to people who ask for it.
Guy Montag | October 20, 2007, 9:45pm | #
The kick in the ass is that libertarians ARE family values folks. Don't have children that you can't support seems like a very moral family value to me.Yes, but if you acidentally have more, you still take care of them even if it means giving up on frills.
David E. Gallaher | October 20, 2007, 10:24pm | #
"Were you in downtown DC today?"I was not, and you have my deepest condolences for having been subjected to the crap.
As it happens, the Little Woman and I were stationed in the DC area at the order of the Marine Corps back during the VN era.
Martin Luther King's (one of the first racial racketeers) "Tent City" pissed me off in the same manner as what seems to be afflicting you.
Edward | October 20, 2007, 10:36pm | #
How to believe that Ron Paul will win:Overvalue every scrap of evidence that suggests he might win, and discount any thing that indicates he can't.
This also works for beliving in God, UFOs, reincarnation, 9/11 conspiracy theories, and Santa Claus.
Let me get this straight -- Ron Paul supporters have been skewing on-line polls for months. Ron Paul has a campaign staff that I assume is aware of this. The FRC straw poll can be had for a dollar per voter. Why weren't his supporters informed? I mean for crying out loud people were driving like 600 miles to Ames even though they couldn't vote there just to show support. WTF? This is a major gaffe by this campaign. This could have been a big victory at a tiny cost.
teh | October 20, 2007, 10:54pm | #
Huckabee is the only candidate who understands that the Pottery Barn principle is actually a commandment from God himself.David E. Gallaher | October 20, 2007, 10:57pm | #
sixstring,Are you overvaluing Ron Paul winning an FRC straw poll?
If I were running for Prez on the anarchist ticket, that is last poll I would want to win.
sixstring | October 20, 2007, 11:12pm | #
David G. -- Possibly. But this was low hanging fruit. NBC news not 30 seconds ago delivered the straw poll results -- Rudy came in 8th, and Mitt won the poll while Baptist minister Huckabee was a close second.Oh, and he is running on the Republican ticket so yes, this was of value.
Bingo | October 20, 2007, 11:32pm | #
sixstring:I don't think Ron Paul can win evangelicals over for the simple fact that they view the war in Iraq as a proxy war against any liberal or democrat view or policy.
To get an idea of why they don't like Ron Paul and their "logic" behind it, read this comment page: http://www.godtube.com/view_video.php?viewkey=0df69aed5c8a90125e69
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im sorry guys but i dont think i could support this guy......all he wants is whats best for America.....thats good and all but its not what Christ wants.....Christ served people.....i believe that God would want us to continue to try to help in Iraq....to serve them in any way we can as True Americans
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Um, are we seriously saying vote for the most liberal conservative? He supports abortion, homosexual marriage, etc Maybe we need to have bible study... As for Iraq, it was prophetic we the USA go there, we are in the end times, we can add that to our bible study
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ps: how do I add quote tags?
sixstring | October 21, 2007, 12:13am | #
"I don't think Ron Paul can win evangelicals over for the simple fact that they view the war in Iraq as a proxy war against any liberal or democrat view or policy."Well, then, (and I don't think I'm breaking new ground here) they are stoopid. I disagree however on the point. I think equating evangelicals with war hawks is a tenuous position.
Watched the link. Nothing new there. Not sure why you referenced it.
Sorry, I'm html illiterate.
crimethink | October 21, 2007, 12:42am | #
I don't think Ron Paul can win evangelicals over for the simple fact that they view the war in Iraq as a proxy war against any liberal or democrat view or policy.I would agree with that statement. It's similar to the "logic" of libertarians supporting federal funding of embryonic stem cell research, for instance.
TS Hayes | October 21, 2007, 2:22am | #
Why is it the religious conservative base hasn't learned these things about Ron Paul:-he voted against partial birth abortions
-he's pro-life and would end federal funding of abortions
-he's a proclaimed Christian
-he been married for 50 years (just one wife, there Rudy)
-he favors getting rid of the Dept of Education, which would put local control back in schools
Do religious conservatives so see the war in Iraq as some sort of fight between religions and the spread if Islam that they ignore everything else?
Art-P.O.G. | October 21, 2007, 4:09am | #
David E. Gallagher said: "The Reasonoids, or, at least the sub-sub-segment commenting here on family values (gag me with a spoon), are racists..."I don't buy it. I see no racism in any comments people have made in this thread.
If you want to read racism, I suggest you examine the sporadic posts of two individuals who are thwarted constantly by Neu Mejican and co.
ed | October 21, 2007, 8:09am | #
FRC V: LANDSLIDE MITT!Rest of America Watches Football*
*A total of 5,576 votes were cast.
Guy Montag | October 21, 2007, 9:14am | #
Will there be any outrage at Bill Mahr throwing out a Ron Paul supporter from his audience while taping his show?BakedPenguin | October 21, 2007, 9:25am | #
Bingo, you can italicize text by surrounding it with these tags: [i] text you want italicized [/i], except replace the square brackets with "greater than" and "less than" signs.David E. Gallaher | October 21, 2007, 10:37am | #
"I don't think Ron Paul can win evangelicals over for the simple fact that they view the war in Iraq as a proxy war against any liberal or democrat view or policy."Those who allow Judeo-Christianity to control their lives are believers in the theology and tradition of King David and his son King Solomon. In other words the divine rights of kings.
Such thinking is fundamentally racist plus it will always find a way to get into a "just war."
King George the Dubya is their logical master, and Giuliani or Romney or Huckabee is King George's logical heir.
As I said way up there in this thread: Family Value voters should be marginalized the way anarchists are now, although anarchists should be the main stream.
Paul | October 21, 2007, 12:34pm | #
How to believe that Ron Paul can win? Simple. Come to realize that Ron Paul has more supporters than the other candidates.Watch the videos of these rallies, and ask yourself if you've seen that many people in one place for any of the other Republican candidates, paid or otherwise (yes, I'm talking about Romney's and McCain's paying college students to show up and glee-club for them at straw polls and such. Giuliani can't even get paid supporters...
(University of Michigan rally)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-71IwDWRf8
(Nashville rally)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfVcI8EuRWg
(New York rally)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bFcuNeLbK7M
(the only way a New York City crowd like this would assemble for Giuliani would be to protest him)
Edward | October 21, 2007, 4:59pm | #
Wow, Paul is a fast learner. Let's hear it for confirmation bias!Edward | October 21, 2007, 5:01pm | #
Bingo, you can italicize text by surrounding it with these tags: [i] text you want italicized [/i], except replace the square brackets with "greater than" and "less than" signs.+i let me try this -i
Marcvs | October 21, 2007, 6:15pm | #
<i>This is how you do italics</i><b>This is how you do bold</b>
<blockquote>This is how you quote</blockquote>
<a href="http://www.yahoo.com">This is how you link</a>
Marcvs | October 21, 2007, 6:16pm | #
This is how you do italicsThis is how you do bold
This is how you quoteThis is how you link
J sub D | October 21, 2007, 6:24pm | #
Marcvs, where were you when I first started trying to dope out HTML? Of course I'm afflicted with the Y chromosome caused inability to ask for directions and didn't ask.I expect more than a few will benefit from your concise and easily understood lesson.
x,y | October 21, 2007, 7:29pm | #
This is how you do italicsAnd this is why I'm hot, this is why, this is why, this is why I'm hot!
This is how you do bold
This is how you quote
This is how you link
BakedPenguin | October 21, 2007, 7:52pm | #
Marcvs, thanks. I tried using " ' " for comments, like you would in VBA - when that didn't work, I got lazy and substituted the brackets. I'd tried putting simple HTML tables in comments here, and when that didn't work, I stopped trying most tags other than ital, bold, href, or blockquoteEdward, or whoever is using the name - yes, obviously "1 + 2" means "1 is greater than 2". Idiot.
Bingo | October 21, 2007, 10:17pm | #
Haha, thanks marcvs! I guess its just standard html then, I was expecting vbulletin or phpbb tags.